Committee Reports::Report - Reform of Dáil Procedure::31 January, 1974::Report


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REPORT

1. The Informal Committee on the Reform of Dáil Procedure was appointed in April, 1971 to review the procedure followed in Dáil Éireann and to make recommendations for improvements. In its report dated 1st December, 1972 it made a number of recommendations designed to improve the existing procedure and practice of the Dáil. On 13th November, 1973 the Taoiseach stated in the Dáil that the Government were in favour of implementing the recommendations and that action in the matter would be initiated in the Committee on Procedure and Privileges.

2. The Committee has examined the recommendations and as a result of its examination it recommends to the Dáil the adoption of the amendments of Standing Orders required to implement recommendation No. (1) and recommendations Nos. (6) to (13) inclusive, (15) to (20) inclusive, (22), (23), (26), (27), (28) and (30) to (34) inclusive as set out in the summary of recommendations in Part III of the report of the Informal Committee. These amendments are set out in Part 1 of the Schedule to this report. The explanations of them are contained in the body of the report of the Informal Committee.

3. The Committee does not favour acceptance of recommendation No. (2) and it recommends for adoption by the Dáil the following amendment to Standing Order 35 which is designed to remove a conflict in the existing wording of the Standing Order with the decision not to accept the recommendation :—

“In line 1 to delete ‘the’ and substitute ‘a’.”

It agrees with recommendations Nos. (3), (4), (24), (25) and (29) which do not involve amendment of the Standing Orders and in this connection it notes that Nos. (3) and (29) have already been put into practice. With regard to recommendation No. (5) it does not agree that Questions seeking statistical information only should automatically be put down for written reply. It considers that a Member tabling such a Question should have the right to an oral or a written reply. Recommendation No. 14 is recommended for acceptance on the understanding that the selecting of Bills to be referred to Special Committees will be done only with the agreement of the Whips. The Standing Order required to implement recommendation No. (21) is recommended for adoption subject to the substitution of a time limit of one hour for three quarters of an hour for speakers other than the first and main spokesman from each Opposition Party and the Minister or Parliamentary Secretary replying.

4. In examining recommendation No. (26) the Committee had regard to the provisions of Standing Order 86. It considers that, for the purpose of the Standing Order, a group should consist of not less than seven members and it has re-drafted paragraph 1 (b) accordingly. It has also taken the opportunity to provide in the definition in paragraph 1 (a) for Members elected at a bye-election. The following amended version of paragraph (1) is accordingly recommended for adoption :—

“86 (1) For the purpose of this Standing Order a group shall mean—

(a) any Party which had not less than seven members elected to the Dáil at the previous General Election or which, if it had less than seven, attained the number of seven members as a result of a subsequent bye-election, or

(b) all members of the Dáil being not less than seven in number who are not members of any such Party”.

5. The Committee also recommends for adoption the amendments of a technical or drafting nature which were recommended by the Ceann Comhairle to the Informal Committee. These amendments and the reasons for them are set out in Part II of the Schedule.

6. The Committee examined a number of amendments to the Standing Orders recommended by the Ceann Comhairle in addition to those contained in the report of the Informal Committee. These amendments are included in Part II of the Schedule and their purpose is to bring the wording of Standing Orders 19 and 21 into line with the procedure whereby a motion for a late sitting is dealt with by way of Order and not by Resolution. The amendments are recommended for adoption by the Dáil.

7. In considering what further improvement might be effected in the present procedure of the Dáil the Committee has had regard to the practice followed in relation to the making of Ministerial statements. It notes that statements can be made only with the agreement of the House and, where statements are permitted following a Ministerial statement, that the leaders of the principal Opposition Parties only may speak. It seems to the Committee unrealistic that the objection of an individual Member can prevent the making of a Ministerial statement. It considers that a new procedure should now be devised which will dispense with the necessity to obtain the agreement of the House to the making of a Ministerial statement and give discretion to the Chair to allow additional statements. The following new Standing Order is, accordingly, recommended for adoption:

“A member of the Government who has given prior notice to the Ceann Comhairle may make a statement in the House on any matter. No debate shall be permitted on any such statement but further statements may be allowed at the discretion of the Ceann Comhairle from a spokesman nominated by a Party in Opposition.”

(Signed) SEÁN Ó TREASAIGH,

Chairman.

31st January, 1974.

SCHEDULE

PART I.

Standing Order	Amendment
29	In paragraph (1) lines 2 and 8 to delete the words “definite matter of urgent public importance” and substitute the words “specific and important matter of public interest requiring urgent consideration”.
33	To delete the Standing Order and substitute a new Order as follows :—
	“Time for Questions	33. Unless the Dáil shall otherwise order on motion made by a member of the Government Questions shall be taken from 3 p.m. to 4 p.m. on Tuesdays and Wednesdays and from 2.30 p.m. to 3.30 p.m. on Thursdays”.
34	To delete paragraph (1) and substitute a new paragraph as follows :—
		“(1) If a Member
		(i) distinguishes his Question by an asterisk, or
		(ii) so requests in respect of his Question which has not been reached,
		the Member of the Government to whom it is addressed shall cause an answer to be provided in the Official Report of the Debates”.
	In paragraph (2) line 3 of the Standing Order to delete the word “may” and substitute the word “shall”.
40	In line 2 to delete all words after the word “until” and substitute the words “the appropriate question has been proposed from the Chair”.
46	In line 2 to delete the word “decided” and substitute the word “discussed”.
47	In line 2 to delete the word “and” and substitute the word “or”,
58	In line 16 to delete the word “five” and substitute the word “ten”
64	To delete lines 4 and 5.
65	To delete the Standing Order.
66	To delete the Standing Order.
71	To add a new paragraph to the Order as follows:..
	“(2) In the absence of a member nominated by the Committee of Selection to serve on a Special Committee a member of the Dáil nominated by the party to which the absent member belongs may take part in the proceedings and vote in his stead.”
75	In line 5 to delete all words after the word “Dáil” and substitute the words “or of a Select or Special Committee unless such Select or Special Committee otherwise orders”.
77	In line 1 to delete the word “Committees” and substitute the words “the Committee”.
83	To delete all words from the word “and” where it first occurs in line 3 down to and including the word “consideration” in line 7 and to delete the word “other” in line 7.
	After “day” in line 14 to insert “or during the period specified in the motion,”.
86	Before paragraph (2) to insert a new paragraph as follows:—
		“(2) Each group shall have the right to nominate a private member of the group to present a Bill provided that there is not before the Dáil another Bill presented by a member nominated by the group”.
	In paragraph (2) line 2 after the word “group” to insert the word “either” and after the word “name” in line 3 to insert the words “or to proceed with a Stage of a Bill in the Dáil”.
	In paragraph (3) line 2 after the word “moved” to insert the words “or a Stage of a Bill is taken in the Dáil”; after the word “move” in line 4 to insert the words “or the stage of the Bill to be taken”; and in line 5 to delete the words “this motion” and substitute the words “the motion or the Bill”.
87	Before paragraph (2) to insert a new paragraph as follows:—
		“(2) The time allowed for the debate on the motion for the Second Stage of a Bill initiated by a private member shall not exceed a period of six hours in the aggregate. At the expiration of the said period, if the proceedings have not been concluded, the Ceann Comhairle shall put forthwith the question or questions necessary to bring to a conclusion the proceedings on the motion and any amendment thereto”.
	In paragraph (2) line 2 to delete the word “the” and substitute the word “any”.
88	In line 3 to delete the word “introduction” and substitute the word “initiation”.
89	To delete paragraph (1) and substitute the following paragraphs:—
	“Initiation of Bills	89 (1) The title of every Bill presented or to be introduced and a short description of its purpose, prepared by the proposer, and accepted by the Ceann Comhairle, shall appear on the Order Paper.
		(2) Any member may move for leave to introduce a bill. If such motion be opposed the Ceann Comhairle shall permit an explanatory statement not exceeding five minutes in length from the member who moves and from a member who opposes the motion before he puts the question thereon. If leave to introduce the Bill is given, an Order shall be made for its second reading and the Bill shall be printed.
		(3) A member of the Government, Parliamentary Secretary or a private member nominated for the purpose under Standing Order 86 (2) may present a Bill without previously obtaining leave of the House and any Bill so presented shall be printed and an Order for its second reading shall be made”.
90	To add a new paragraph as follows:—
		“(2) If on an amendment to the Motion for the second reading of a Bill it is decided that the words proposed to be deleted stand part of the question, the Bill shall forthwith be declared to be read a second time”
98	To delete the Standing Order and substitute a new Order as follows:—
	“Consideration of Bill on Report	98 (1) If no amendments have been offered to a Bill on Report an Order appointing a day for its Fifth Stage shall be made.
		(2) If amendments have been offered to a Bill on Report the Dáil shall proceed to consider them”.
99	To delete the Standing Order and substitute a new Order as follows:—
	“Motion for recommittal	99 (1) A motion may be made to recommit a Bill either wholly or in respect of certain sections or amendments. The motion may be made at any time before the Order for the Fifth Stage shall have been made.
		(2) If a motion to recommit a Bill be opposed the Ceann Comhairle shall permit an explanatory statement of the reasons for such recommittal from the member who moves and a statement from a member who opposes the motion before he puts the question thereon”.
100	To delete all words from “a bill” in line 1 down to and including “that” in line4.
103	In line 1 to delete “the” and substitute the word “any” and to delete the words and brackets “(if any)” ; and in line 2 to delete all words from the word “and” to the word “affirmed” in line 4.
119	To delete the Standing Order and substitute two new Orders as follows:—
	“Bills involving the imposition of charges upon the people	(1) A Bill which has as its main object the imposition of a charge upon the people shall not be initiated unless a motion approving of the charge has been passed by the Dáil. No such motion as aforesaid nor any amendment thereto proposing to increase the amount stated in any such motion, may be made by any member, save a member of the Government.
		(2) The Committee Stage of a Bill which incidentally involves a Charge upon the people shall not be taken unless a motion approving of the charge has been passed by the Dáil. No such motion as aforesaid nor any amendment thereto proposing to increase the amount stated in any such motion may be made by any member, save a member of the Government.
		(3) An amendment to a Bill which could have the effect of imposing or increasing a charge upon the people may not be moved by any member, save a member of the Government, or Parliamentary secretary”.
	“Bills involving the appropriation of revenue or other public moneys	(1) A Bill which has as its main object the appropriation of revenue, or other public moneys shall not be initiated by any member, save a member of the Government.
		(2) The Committee Stage of a Bill which involves the appropriation of revenue or other public moneys shall not be taken unless the purpose of the appropriation has been recommended to the Dáil by a Message from the Government. The text of any Message shall be printed on the Order paper [See Article 17.2 of the Constitution].
		(3) An amendment to a Bill which could have the effect of imposing or increasing a charge upon the revenue may not be moved by any member, save a member of the Government or parliamentary Secretary”.
New (before 120)	Before Standing Order 120 to insert a new Order as follows:—
New (before 120)	“Grants for public service	Every grant of money proposed for the public service shall be considered by the Dáil on a motion, which shall be decided without amendment, stating the amount to be granted and the particular service for which the sum is demanded. No such motion as aforesaid may be made by any member, save a member of the Government”.
121	In line 5 to delete the word “April” and substitute the words “the financial year”
122	To delete the Standing Order.
123	To delete the Standing Order.
124	To delete the Standing Order.
New (before 125)	Before Standing Order 125 to insert a new Order as follows:—
New (before 125)	“Divisions on Estimates	(1) The Ceann Comhairle shall, where a division has been demanded on an Estimate in the house or on any motion taken in conjunction with such Estimate, postpone the taking of every such division until 10.15 p.m. on that day if the House sits until that hour and, if not, to 10.15 p.m. on the next day on which the House shall sit until that hour.
		(2) At 10.15 p.m. any business then under consideration shall be interrupted to take every such division. Where more than one division is to be taken at 10.15 p.m. the divisions shall be taken in the chronological order in which they were demanded.
		(3) If at the time appointed for the interruption of business proceedings under this Order are in progress, the Ceann Comhairle shall not effect such interruption until the proceedings in connection with all divisions and questions outstanding shall have been completed”.
125	To delete the Standing Order.
New (before 127)	Before Standing Order 127 to insert a new Order as follows:—
New (before 127)	“Time limit on speeches on Financial Resolutions and Estimates	Unless the Dáil shall otherwise order the speech of a member in the course of a debate on a motion for the imposition of a charge upon the people or for a grant of money proposed for the public service shall not exceed one hour: Provided that the speech of the first speaker from a group (as defined by Standing Order (86) (1) (a)) in opposition and the speech of the member of the Government or Parliamentary Secretary replying to the debate shall not exceed in each case one hour and a half: Provided further that this order shall not apply to the speech of a member of the Government or Parliamentary Secretary opening the debate”

SCHEDULE

PART II

Standing Order	Amendment		Reason
11	In line 3 after the word “absent” to insert the words “then for the period of absence of both” and in line 9 to delete the words “for that day only”		It may happen that the Ceann Comhairle and Leas-Cheann Comhairle are both absent over a number of days. It should not be necessary for the house on each of the days to proceed afresh to an election.
13	In line 5 after the word “appointed” to insert the words “for the purpose of these Standing Orders.”		It would appear from a recent judgment of the High Court that the Ceann Comhairle after a dissolution of the House was no longer Ceann Comhairle for the purpose of membership of Appeal Board under the Electoral Act, 1963, S. 13.
15.	1. In line 4 to delete the word “two” and substitute the word “five”		1. The figure “two” has long been unrealistic.
	2. In line 5 to delete the words “presiding member” and substitute the words “temporary Chairman”.		2. The phrase “presiding member” has a constitutional significance and it includes the Leas-Cheann Comhairle.
New (before 16)	To insert a new Order as follows:—
	“Duties and authority of Leas-Cheann Comhairle	While the Leas-Cheann Comhairle (or a temporary Chairman) is in the Chair he shall perform the duties devolved upon, and exercise the authority conferred upon the Ceann Comhairle by these Standing Orders save as may be otherwise provided therein”.	There is nothing in the Standing Orders to indicate what are the duties and authority of the Leas Cheann Comhairle.
16	In paragraph (2) line 1 to delete the words “All orders and official documents” and substitute the words “The Order Paper, the Journal of Proceedings of the Dáil and all other appropriate documents”.		The present provision does not accord with the facts. The Dáil does not issue orders unless the word is used in the very restricted sense of Standing Order 88 (3). If “Official documents” means documents issued under the authority of the Office then they include Bills and Debates, which are ordinarily issued in English only.
18	In line 8 after the word “rung” to insert the words “for a period of not less than three minutes”.		The bell ringing period is just as necessary to be known as the subsequent waiting period
19	1. In paragraph (2) lines 4, 5 and 6 to delete the words “the Chairman shall report progress and ask leave to sit again” and substitute the words “progress shall be reported and leave asked to sit again” and in paragraph (5) lines 6 and 7 to delete the words “or the Chairman as the case may be”.		1. Drafting. The Chairman appears in many places in the Standing Orders as an alternative to the Ceann Comhairle. This appears to have been a result of copying British terminology in the original drafting of the Standing Orders. In the British House of Commons the Speaker does not preside over the House in Committee.
	2. In paragraph (2), lines 6 and 7 to delete the words “a Resolution shall have been adopted” and substitute “an Order shall have been made” and in line 10 to delete “Resolution” and substitute “Order”.		2. Late sittings are dealt with by way of Order and not by Resolution.
	3. In Paragraph (3) lines 4 and 5 to delete the words “(3.30 p.m. on Thursdays)” and substitute the words “on the former days and 3.30 p.m. on the latter day”.		3. Drafting. Aligns with wording in Standing Order 20.
20	In line 11 to delete the word “than” and in line 14 to delete the words “on the Order paper” and substitute the words “to be taken”.		Drafting.
21	1. In line 5 to delete “a Resolution shall have been adopted” and substitute “an Order shall have been made”.		1. See note to Standing Order 19.
	2. In lines 6 and 7 to delete the words “or the Chairman, as the case may be,”.		2. Drafting. See note to Standing Order 19.
25	To delete the Standing Order and substitute a new Order as follows:—		As it stands at the moment the Standing Order is defective. 3 (1) (a), (b), (c) and (d) do not represent the existing position. The redraft is in the light of the proposed recommendations.
	“Routine of Business	25. The ordinary routine of business in the Dáil shall be as follows:—
		*1. Questions
		2. Private Business
		3. Public Business—
		(i) At the commencement of Public Business—
		(a) Reports from Committees.
		(b) Messages From the Seanad.
		(c) Bills from the Seanad.
		(d) Initiation of Bills.
		(e) Notices of Motions.
		(ii) Orders of the day.
		The ordinary routine of business in Private Members’ time (S.O. 83) shall be as follows:—
		(i) Adjourned Business given priority under Standing Orders.
		(ii) Business given precedence under Standing Order 86 (3).
		(iii) Other Business ordered.
		(iv) Other Notices of Motions.”
26	In lines 1 and 2 to delete the words “as soon as Questions shall have been disposed of” and substitute the words “before the commencement of Public Business”.		Private Business does not follow Questions on a Thursday.
30	In line 1 after the word “questions” to insert the words “to a member of the Government” and in lines 7 and 8 to delete the words “to a member of the Government”.		Drafting.
34	In paragraph (2) line 2 after the word “reply” to insert the words “or a reply in the form of a tabular statement”.		This is the usual reason why an answer is furnished in the Official Report.
37	In lines 3 and 4 to delete the words “or the Chairman as the case may be”.		Drafting See note to Standing Order 19.
38	In lines 1 and 2 to delete the words “or the Chairman”.		Drafting. See note to Standing Order 19.
39	In line 3 to delete all words after the word “proposer”.		It is the practice of the House to have one debate only on a motion with amendments. A Question may be proposed which includes an amendment, e.g. “That words stand”. If this cannot be done the amendment is discussed with the motion and a separate question put on it, if necessary, when the debate has concluded.
45	In line 7 after the word “rescind” to insert the words “or amend”.		Drafting.
47	In lines 3 and 5 to delete the words “or the Chairman”.		Drafting See note to Standing Order 19.
48	To delete the Standing Order and substitute a new Order as follows:—		Drafting.
	“Maintenance of order in Dáil and Committees	The Ceann Comhairle is the judge of order in the Dáil and in Committee of the whole Dáil and has authority to suppress disorder and to enforce prompt obedience to his ruling. In Select or Special Committees order shall be maintained by the Chair man, but disorder or obstruction in Committees can be censured only in the Dáil on receiving a report”.
49	To add a new paragraph as follows:—		This is the practice.
	“(2) A member may be named or the Dáil called on to adjudge upon his conduct only when the Ceann Comhairle is in the Chair”.
50	In lines 11, 12 and 13 to delete the words “Chairman shall forthwith suspend proceedings and report the circumstances to the Dáil” and substitute the words “proceedings shall forthwith be suspended and the circumstances reported to the Dáil”.		Drafting. See note to Standing Order19.
53	In paragraph (3) line 1 to delete all words after the word “that” and substitute the words “no member may claim to move ‘That the question be now put’ unless the Ceann Comhairle is in the Chair”		This is to prevent incidents such as occurred in July 1967 where the Ceann Comhairle was repeatedly sent for to take the Chair when the Leas-Cheann Comhairle was in the Chair.
54	To delete the Standing Order.		The Standing Order has never been invoked since its adoption on 24th July, 1923. It is probable that the assent of the Chair would be withheld if some member at this stage tried to get it working.
55	In line 1 before “A” to insert the words “A member of the Government or” and add as a footnote “[See Article 28.8 of the Constitution]”.		The Standing Order should show the complete picture.
56	In paragraph (1) line 3 and in paragraph (2) line 1 to delete the words “or Chairman”.		Drafting. See note to Standing Order 19.
57	1. In line 2 to delete the words “or Chair- man”.		1. Drafting. See note to Standing Order 19.
	2. In line 3 after the word “once” to insert the words “for a period of not less than three minutes”.		2. See note to Standing Order 18.
58 “or Chairman”.	In lines 3, 7, 8 and 12 to delete the words “or Chairman”.		Drafting. See note to Standing
59	In line 3 to delete the words “or Chairman”.		Drafting. See note to Standing Order 19.
63	In line 6 after the word “rung” to insert the words “for a period of not less than three minutes”.		See note to Standing Order 18.
64	To delete lines 6 and 7.		This follows from the deletion of Standing Order 54.
67	In line 6 to delete the word “to” and substitute the word “of” and in line 8 to delete the words “such committee’ and substitute the word “it”.		Drafting.
72	To delete all words from the word “The” in line 1 to the word “Committee’ in line 3.		The provision is never operated and is unnecessary.
79	To delete “clerks” in line 2 and substitute “joint staff”.		Drafting.
82	In paragraph (1) line 2 after the word “Dáil” to insert the words “for each sitting” and in paragraph (2) line 2 to delete the words “paper, document, and”.		Drafting.
90	In line 9 to delete the word “omitting” and substitute the word “deleting”.		Drafting.
91	In line 9 to delete the words “such special” and substitute the word “the” and in lines 9 and 10 to delete the words “such Committee” and substitute the word “it”.		Drafting.
94	In paragraph (2) lines 2 and 3 to delete the words “Chairman shall put the question” and substitute the words “question shall be put”		Drafting. See note to Standing Order 19.
96	In paragraph (2) line 4 to delete the word “them” and substitute the words “it”		Drafting.
102	In line 3 and 4 to delete the words “upon rates or local burthens upon the people or impose pecuniary penalties” and substitute the words “on the public revenue or upon the people”.		The original provision is an archaic one. Bills have to be recommitted in respect of amendment imposing charges on the revenue or upon the people.
106	In paragraph (1) line 5 to insert the word “a” before the word “Resolution” and to delete the words “of the Dáil”.		Drafting.
113	In paragraph (1) line 1 before the word “There” to insert the words “As soon as may be following the reassembly of the Dáil subsequent to a General Election” and in lines 1 and 2 to delete the words “at the commencement of each Dáil”.		Drafting Aligns with phraseology in Standing order 73 and 74.
126	In lines 1 and 4 to delete the word “Vote” and substitute the word “Estimate”.		Drafting.
128	In lines 4 and 5 to delete the words “as required by Article 22 of the Constitution and substitute the words “that it is a Money Bill” and to subscribe at the end “[See Article 22.2 of the Constitution]”.		Drafting.
134	In line 5 to delete the words “Money Bills” and substitute the words “a Money Bill”.		Drafting.
138	In paragraph (3) line 3 to delete the words “or the names of the members”; in paragraph (4) lines 2 and 4 to delete the words “or members”; and in paragraph (4) line 3 to delete the words “or vacancies” and in line 5 to delete the words “or their”.		Drafting.
140	In paragraph (2) line 4 to delete the word “any”.		Drafting.

* Subject to the provisions of Standing Order 33.