Committee Reports > List of Committees > Seanad > 1956 > Select Committee on Statutory Instruments > Report No. 02 (1956) - Statutory Instruments

APPENDIX XIV.

Garda Síochána Allowances Order, 1955 (S.I. No. 271 of 1955). Garda Síochána Pay Order, 1956 (S.I. No. 15 of 1956).

(i)

9 Márta, 1956.

Rúnaí,

Roinn Dlí agus Cirt.

I am directed by the Select Committee on Statutory Instruments to state that they have had under consideration (i) the Garda Síochána Allowances Order, 1955 [S.I. No. 271 of 1955], (ii) The Garda Síochána Pay Order, 1955 [S.I. No. 272 of 1955] and (iii) the Garda Síochána Pay Order, 1956 [S.I. No. 15 of 1956] each of which is made in pursuance of Section 12 of the Police Forces Amalgamation Act, 1925. The Committee note that the first two of these Orders were made on the 11th January, 1956, viz. the date on which the sanction of the Minister for Finance was attested to each instrument but that the title of each instrument bears the date 1955 and not 1956. In consequence of this, the title of the third Order—Garda Síochána Pay Order, 1956—would also appear to be affected. I am to request, in the circumstances, that a memorandum be furnished for the information of the Committee on the matter.

It is also noted that in the case of the Garda Síochána Pay Order, 1955, the instrument contains a statement of compliance with the provisions of Section 12 (2) of the Act, which is in accordance with the recommendations contained in Paragraph 8 of the First Report of the Select Committee dated 11th May, 1955. The Committee note, however, that no such statement is included in the Garda Síochána Allowances Order, 1955, or in the Garda Síochána Pay Order, 1956. In view of their recommendation in the matter, the Committee would be glad to be furnished with a memorandum on the omission of this statement in the case of the two latter orders.

As the Committee would like to consider these matters at their next meeting they would appreciate a reply by the 22nd instant.

Cléireach an Rogha-Choiste.

(ii)

(Department of Justice)

Sráid Mhuirbhthean Uacht

(Upper Merrion Street)

Baile átha Cliath

(Dublin).

4/428

4/38/39

4/38/30.

Secretary,

Select Committee on Statutory Instruments.

I am directed by the Minister for Justice to refer to your minute of the 9th March regarding

(i The Gárda Síochána Allowances Order, 1955,

(ii) The Garda Síochána Pay Order, 1955, and

(iii) The Garda Síochána Pay Order, 1956.

In reply I am to inform you that, in the Minister’s view, the title of each of the Instruments in question bears the proper date. He is supported in this view by a ruling received from the Attorney-General in relation to the Garda Síochána Pensions Order, 1951 (No. 410 of 1951). This Order was signed by the Minister for Justice on the 29th December, 1951, and countersigned by the Minister for Finance on the 2nd February, 1952. A ruling was sought, for the purpose of implementing Article 5 (b) (ii) of that Order, as to what was the “critical date” mentioned in Article 4 (1) of the Order. The following is an extract from the Attorney-General’s ruling in the matter: “In my opinion the Order was made on the 29th December, 1951, and this is the instrument to which the Minister for Finance has signified his approval. The ‘critical date’ therefore is 29th December, 1951..............................”

With regard to the point raised in the Second paragraph of your minute under reply I am to inform you that the statement of compliance with the provisions of Article 12 (2) of the Act was inadvertently included in the Garda Síochána Pay Order, 1955. As already indicated to your Committee in this Department’s minute of the 14th April, 1955 (your reference 90/6/55) the Attorney-General has advised that these Orders need not show jurisdiction on their face, that the recitals as to compliance with the provisions of Section 12 (2) do not affect the validity of the Orders and that being surplusage and unnecessary the recitals need not appear.

I am, however, to inform you that the requirements of sub-section 2 of Section 12 of the 1925 Act were duly complied with in respect of the Garda Síochána Allowances Order, 1955, and the Garda Síochána Pay Order, 1956.

(iii)

I am directed by the Select Committee on Statutory Instruments to state that they have had under further consideration the Garda Síochána Allowances Order, 1955, the Garda Síochána Pay Order, 1955, and the Garda Síochána Pay Order, 1956, together with Mr. Connolly’s minute of 16 Márta, 1956, thereon.

The principal matters they have considered are (a) the view contained in Mr. Connolly’s minute that the date on which these Orders were made is the date of signature by the Minister for Justice and not the date of counter-signature by the Minister for Finance and (b) in view of the recommendations made by the Committee in this matter in paragraph 8 of the First Report of the Select Committee, the omission in these Orders of a statement of compliance with Section 12 (2) of the Police Forces Amalgamation Act, 1925.

The Committee have arranged to consider these matters again at their next meeting and they would be glad if you would nominate a representative to assist them in their consideration.

I should be glad to learn the name of the representative as soon as possible to enable arrangements to be made for his attendance.

Cléireach an Rogha-Choiste.

See Minutes of Evidence.

(iv)

Sráid Mhuirbhthean Uacht.

(Upper Merrion Street),

Baile átha Cliath

(Dublin).

The Secretary,

Senate Select Committee on Statutory Instruments,

Leinster House.

I am directed by the Minister for Justice to refer to previous correspondence and to my appearance before the Select Committee, and to submit the following further observations with reference to the undermentioned Statutory Instruments, viz.,

(i) The Garda Síochána Allowances Order, 1955 (S.I. No. 271/1955);

(ii) The Garda Síochána Pay Order, 1955 (S.I. No. 272/1955), and

(iii) The Garda Síochána Pay Order, 1956 (S.I. No. 15/1956).

I am to say, in the first place, that the view of the Select Committee that Instruments of the kind in question should contain a statement of compliance with the provisions of section 12 (2) of the Police Forces Amalgamation Act, 1925, has been brought to the notice of the Parliamentary Draughtsman, who has now expressed his willingness to include such a statement in future Instruments of the kind, in deference to the views of the Select Committee, though he remains of the opinion that it is unnecessary to do so.

I am to say, secondly, that the Minister is advised that the date of the making of each of the several Orders in question was the date upon which each was signed by him, from which it follows that there was an omission by the Department to comply with section 3 (1) (a) of the Statutory Instruments Act, 1947. This is regretted and steps have been taken to see that it does not happen again.

Finally, I am to say that there is no analogy between Rules of Court and the Instruments which are the subject of this communication. The Rule-making authority is the appropriate Rules Committee with the concurrence of the Minister for Justice and there can, in effect, be no Rules until the Minister expresses his concurrence. This is not normally forthcoming for some considerable time after the Rules have been drafted as they have to be subjected to examination in the Department.

(Signed) F. C. CONNOLLY.

13th June, 1956.

(v)

Leinster House,

Dublin.

An Rúnaí,

Roinn Airgeadais.

I am instructed by the Select Committee on Statutory Instruments to write to you regarding a point which has arisen relating to the dating of an instrument where more than one Minister is involved, as when the sanction, concurrence or agreement of another Minister is required.

This point first arose in connection with the Local Government (Dublin) (Temporary) Act, 1948 (Continuance No. 1) Order, 1954 (S.I. No. 142 of 1954). In connection with that instrument, evidence given by the Legal Adviser to the Department of Local Government was to the effect that the second date was the date of the instrument (Vide Pages 37 and 38 of the Committee’s First Report, T. 152 dated 11th May, 1955).

The point arose again on the Garda Síochána Pay Order, 1955 (S.I. No. 272 of 1955), which was signed by the Minister for Justice on the 9th December, 1955, and countersigned by the Minister for Finance on the 11th January, 1956. My Committee was informed by the Department of Justice that the Attorney General had advised that the date of the making of the order was the 9th December, 1955, i.e. the date of the first signature. (Copies of the correspondence and of evidence taken are attached).

In the evidence referred to in the preceding paragraph reference was made to Rules of Court. It will be noted that in the minute of 13th June it is stated by the Department of Justice that there is no analogy between an instrument such as the Garda Síochána Pay Order, 1955, and Rules of Court. The latter rules are made by a Rules Committee, and require the concurrence of the Minister for Justice. In the case of some of these rules the Department has taken the date of the second signature as being the effective date.

In view of the foregoing, there would appear to be a conflict of opinion in regard to the date of making of instruments which require more than one signature. Arising from the Attorney General’s advice, my Committee considers that three difficulties may arise: (i) compliance with section (3) of the Statutory Instruments Act, 1947, as amended, regarding notice of making, etc.—experience has shown that there has often been a considerable time lag between the date of the first and second signature (34 days intervened in the case of the Garda Síochána (Pay) Order, 1955); (ii) compliance with the requirement of the Committee that instruments be presented within seven days after making, and (iii) the form of approval of the consenting Minister (e.g. if the basis of the Attorney General’s ruling is similar to that put forward in the Local Government (Dublin) (Temporary) Act, 1948 (Continuance No. 1) Order, 1954) the question of the use of the word “hereby” requires to be considered).

The matter will arise from time to time in the various Departments and my Committee is of opinion that action should be taken to ensure that uniformity of practice is followed. My Committee considers that this could best be ensured by your Department, as, in the case of the majority of instruments of the nature referred to, the Minister for Finance is the second Minister. In the circumstances I am instructed to ask you to be so good as to furnish a memorandum, indicating whether, in view of the apparent conflict of legal opinion, any, and if so what, action is intended to be taken in the matter.

My Committee is anxious to complete its consideration of this matter so that it can be incorporated in its second Report. The Report has been delayed as a result of the correspondence with the Department of Justice in the matter and my Committee wishes to issue it as soon as possible. In the circumstances, the favour of a reply by the 12th July would be appreciated.

Cléireach an Rogha-Choiste.

29 Meitheamh, 1956.

(vi)

Sráid Mhuirbhthean Uacht

(Upper Merrion Street),

Baile Átha Cliath

(Dublin).

S. 46/8/55.

Cléireach,

Rogha-Choiste um Ionstraimí Reachtúla,

Seanad Éireann.

I am directed by the Minister for Finance to refer to your minute of 29th June, 1956, regarding Statutory Instruments which fall to be signed by more than one Minister. It appears to the Minister that the difficulties referred to in the minute under reply could best be removed by a provision under which a Department sponsoring an Instrument calling for the signature of more than one Minister would make the necessary arrangements to ensure that there would be a common date of signature by the Ministers concerned. It is proposed to provide accordingly by the issue to all Departments of a Circular of which a draft is enclosed.

2 Lúnasa, 1956.

Draft.

S. 46/8/55

Circular /56.

Printing and Publication of Statutory Instruments.

A Dhuine Uasail,

I am directed by the Minister for Finance to refer to Circular 15/55 as amended by Circular 8/56, and to say it is desired to obviate difficulties which may arise in the case of Statutory Instruments (requiring the signature of more than one Minister) which are signed by the Ministers concerned on different dates. To remove these difficulties the Minister wishes arrangements to be made so as to ensure that there is a common date of signature by the Ministers concerned in the case of such Instruments. Accordingly the Instructions enclosed with Circular 15/55 (as amended by Circular 8/56) are hereby amended by the insertion of the following paragraph immediately after paragraph 8:—

“8A. In the case of Statutory Instruments which require the signature of more than one Minister the sponsoring Department should make advance arrangements to ensure that there is a common date of signature by the Ministers concerned.”

To

All Departments, etc.